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Vic Fires

the ‘gathering point’ (schwepes centre bendigo) across the road from my daughters exploded in flames yesterday…...burnt all the houses around and past my daughters but my trusty son in law saved the house :) (some of em are good blokes hey :))
Not going in there as gawkers will be everywhere .....instead asked them out here for dinner.
and we’ll watch a Disney movie I think ;)
Been a terrible lead up to this and everyone was exhausted before it even started.

I’m off for an afternoon shift mop up with the CFA (I’m the lazy bastard drivin’ ;) ......thats all these young bucks will let us do now)

If any of you guys do prayers…a few for the familys that have lost loved ones and also those who have lost their homes…..it was big!

edit….thanks Owen ;)

[ Edited: 08 February 2009 08:52 AM by michael scull]
 

Prayers indeed.
The devastation is terrible.
The losses unimaginable.

 

I helped on ash wednesday in the black forest and that was a day of just save yourself I can tell you ....such confusion in the smoke is all I really remember .....and the heat.

My heart goes out to all those people concerned ....yesterday was a shocker….....but not a bad day for my grandson who dads is one of those blended ones but yesterday he was hero in my grandsons eyes which won’t hurt the bond at all :)

[ Edited: 08 February 2009 09:01 AM by michael scull]
 

84+ dead, what a sad day.

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Good grief

 

Sadly and unbelievably the toll climbs…

108 killed in Victorian bushfires
Article from: AAP
February 09, 2009 06:24am
THE death toll in the Victorian bushfires has risen to 108, the Department of Sustainability and Environment (DSE) said early this morning.

Firefighters have worked through the night to battle 31 fires across scorched Victoria.

At least 750 homes have been destroyed and more than 330,000ha burnt out, while authorities said some fires could take weeks to contain…...

http://www.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/story/0,22049,25027095-5001028,00.html

More stories and image galleries are at :
http://www.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/story/0,22049,25026762-5001021,00.html

 

0,,6476586,00_thumb.jpg

 

I’m our local CFA tech/maintenance officer (just means if it runs out of anything they ring me) and I went out with the our district leader yesterday arvo for a drive area the outer fire zone with an infrared cam.
I took a standard vid of the whole lot.
Fire just raced across the dry burbs of bendigo and actually most places that went were really unlucky. Streets were just scorched and blackened but superficially from the heat just passing by .....then suddenly three houses in a row gone.  A few brush fences carried fires into houses and gazebo and creepers etc joined to houses.
Supposedly we are going to have to legislate some different materials for burbs gardens that fit in better with our NO WATERing policies in town now.
Bendigo over all just took a scorching really but it scared a whole community here as it made it way through 5 suburbs in a town of 80,000 people all the way to within 2kms of the towns centre and fountain.

certainly not the devastation that other areas of Vic received .....but I think it has made a major impact on the townies of Bendigo who thought they were immune and bush fires were for the bush.

Not long ago some of these same people along the same ridge wore the brunt of a tornado .....some may scoff but this was as big to these people as any pan handle twister.
Bendigo Tornado (personally think the best pics here are the ones in the middle of the page)
Some of the same people have copped it again.

I also met some members of Bendigo Bank together with some RACV reps going house to house to see what people needed and just basically checking everyones OK.
  Communities really pulled together with this one.

was just thinking that our own little communities afterschool activities group may have found a new theme for the Float for the Bendigo Easter Parade ....maybe honour all the services and community itself with a simple float full of kids in dressups of doc & nurses, firebrigade & police, radio djs (who followed the fire across town live to air) mums and dads with garden hoses, just rows of guys with wet hessian bags beating it out,  etc.
Was going to be an environmental theme ......just need to figure out how to get the women to come up with this new idea for the float.

[ Edited: 09 February 2009 07:04 AM by michael scull]
 

I have family in Bendigo, it’s a place I know well. We always think a town that size will be safe. Nothing is safe now.

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Jeremiah 29:11

 

My heart and prayers go out to all the victims’ families and friends.  Unprecented losses and damage.

They say that about half of all bushfires are deliberately lit, even accounting for the original sin doctrine why would firebugs do such a wicked thing?!  If there’s one area where the original “eye and tooth” OT thing applies…

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I hope our brothers and sisters in Victoria know of our prayers, which are urgent and heartfelt. A dad in our church learned on the weekend that his Victorian parents and friends lost everything in the fires.

May God have mercy and may His people respond in prayer and with practical and emotional support.

 

We prayed heartfully for these people and the folks in North Queensland too yesterday.
Don’t be surprised if appeals soon appear from the various dioceses and mission agencies asking for support.

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There is an amazing report on the Australian online edition :

Australian

Click on the 4 audio reports - and watch slideshows as you listen to the journalists.

They have just announced the toll now standing at 126.

[ Edited: 09 February 2009 02:11 PM by Kevin Goddard]
 

An article summing up the impact on Anglican churches.

 

a friend and a really caring family guy who had this up yesterday ....he and another photographer friend of mine Robbie love these areas and camp with their families up in these hills often
Lindsay sent me this yesterday and I think the offer deserves to be passed along.
Honest lad, blue collar worker who just loves his community ....and is doing what he can as quick as he can.
His email .....
‘Hi Everyone,
As most of you are aware we have just had the worst bushfire day in Australia’s history. To date 108 people have lost their lives.
I photograph in the areas that have been wiped of the map and I feel I need to give something back.
I head to Marysville all the time and this is the community I want to help out.
I have put together a calendar of shots from Marysville and all profits will go to the people of Marysville. Sales of the calendar are going along nicely.

I will also be approaching fellow photographers who photograph this area to help me with a gallery display at Healesville with profits going to charity as well.

Donations can also be made to the Red Cross, Salvation Army and the Bendigo Bank.

Clothing is also needed. Have a look in your cupboards etc for clothing. If you haven’t worn it for 12 months will you wear it again?’

Lindsays Knowles tag .....he’s no scammer, I know the gentleman well ....he is Loo, a moderator and well respected member of the WeatherZone forum.
http://www.redbubble.com/people/lindsayknowles/calendars/2542005-1-marysville
http://www.redbubble.com/people/lindsayknowles/journal/2542178-marysville-bushfire-sales

[ Edited: 09 February 2009 04:35 PM by michael scull]
 

Shifting winds flare up fire fronts
Sarah Wotherspoon - HERALD-SUN
February 09, 2009

UPDATE 5:10pm
A NUMBER of Victorian towns are under attack from fires still raging across the state.

The CFA has issued an urgent threat message to residents in the Thomson Rd, Churchill area and said the area was under direct attack from the Churchill fire.

Residents were warned to be on the lookout for flying embers.

The Churchill fire is also likely to breach the Carrajung - Woodside Rd within the hour with the CFA warning residents on the east side of the road, between Napier and Sheilds Rds, to be on alert for fire.

An urgent threat message was also issued to the communities of Crystal Creek, Crystal Creek Road, Scrubby Creek, Acheron, and along Whanregarwen Road from the Maroondah Highway near Alexandra through to Molesworth.

DSE spokesman Lee Miezis said the Murrindindi edge of the Kinglake Complex fire was threatening the towns and warned residents to prepare for thick smoke and flying embers.

The Toolangi community, northeast of Melbourne, has also been warned they could be directly impacted by a fire burning southeast of the town.

Residents have been told to active their fire plan and prepare for ember attack….......

link

 

Don’t wish to make this a chat thread but was just talking on the phone a moment ago with Ian Lawther who is in healesville in his muddie house with his wife and grown family…..he said the chopper was doing water drops just over the hill and I could hear the quiver in his voice. Ian found himself nearly bliind over the last few years and it leaves him feeling a little useless at times like these.
Didn’t stay on the phone as I didn’t wish to block the line but I come away feeling abit useless myself :(

Hope all these people are safe tonight ......Ian said as he rang off that the thought they had a few sleepless nights ahead of them looking at the weather ......I must do that myself.
Ian posted a few times on the SydAngForum…....Ian I’ve only known but a few years and found him to be too caring for his own good .....well I really hope he looks after himself and his family stays safe through this.

[ Edited: 09 February 2009 07:09 PM by michael scull]
 

Prayers…

 

Anyone see Lateline last night? Sounds like some climate experts are suggesting that insurance companies might not want to continue supporting vulnerable bushland areas into the future, especially if these things become 1 in 15 year events instead of 1 in 30 to 70 year events.

What do people think about rebuilding the smaller, “deep bush” communities that are right in the path of these apocalyptic nightmares, especially if — as the climate dudes are suggesting — they are going to become far more common?

(They’re not suggesting abandoning Bendigo! Wow, thanks for the Bendigo stories… I lived there for 3 years at Fortuna Villa doing the Army Survey thing.)

 

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Have awoken to the news that the toll has reached 173.
The Australian has a must-read article :

Victoria bushfires stoked by green vote

David Packham   February 10, 2009     Article from:  The Australian

VICTORIA has suffered the most tragic bushfire disaster to have occurred on this continent throughout its period of human habitation.

The deaths, loss of homes and businesses and the blow to our feeling of security will take decades to fade into history. The trauma will live with the victims, who, to a greater or lesser extent, are all of us.

How could this happen when we have been told in a withering, continuous barrage of public relations that with technology and well-polished uniforms, we can cope with the unleashing of huge forces of nature.

I have been a bushfire scientist for more than 50 years, dealing with all aspects of bushfires, from prescribed burning to flame chemistry, and serving as supervisor of fire weather services for Australia. We need to understand what has happened so that we can accept or prevent future fire disasters.

That this disaster was about to happen became clear when the weather bureau issued an accurate fire weather forecast last Wednesday, which prompted me, as a private citizen, to raise the alarm through a memo distributed to concerned residents.

The science is simple. A fire disaster of this nature requires a combination of hot, dry, windy weather in drought conditions. It also requires a source of ignition. In the past, this purpose has been served by lightning. In this disaster, lightning has not played a big part, and for this Victorians should be grateful. But other sources of ignition are ever-present. When the temperature and wind increase to extreme levels, small events—perhaps the scrape of metal across a rock, a transformer overheating or sparks from a diesel engine—are capable of starting a fire that can in minutes become unstoppable if the fuel is present.


The third and only controllable factor in this deadly triangle is fuel: the dead leaves, pieces of bark and grass that become the gas that feeds the 50m high flames that roar through the bush with the sound of jet engines.

Fuels build up year after year at an approximate rate of one tonne a hectare a year, up to a maximum of about 30 tonnes a hectare. If the fuels exceed about eight tonnes a hectare, disastrous fires can and will occur. Every objective analysis of the dynamics of fuel and fire concludes that unless the fuels are maintained at near the levels that our indigenous stewards of the land achieved, then we will have unhealthy and unsafe forests that from time to time will generate disasters such as the one that erupted on saturday.

It has been a difficult lesson for me to accept that despite the severe damage to our forests and even a fatal fire in our nation’s capital, the political decision has been to do nothing that will change the extreme threat to which our forests and rural lands are exposed.

The decision to ignore the threat has been encouraged by some shocking pseudo-science from a few academics who use arguments that may have a place in political discourse but should have no place in managing our environment and protecting it and us from the bushfire threat.

The conclusion of these academics is that high intensity fires are good for the environment and that the resulting mudslides after rains are merely localised and serve to redistribute nutrients. The purpose of this failed policy is to secure uninformed city votes.

Only a few expert retired fire managers, experienced bushies and some courageous politicians are prepared to buck the decision to lock up our bush and leave it to burn.

The politicians who willingly accept this rubbish use it to justify the perpetuation of the greatest threat to our forests, water supplies, homes and lives in order to secure a minority green vote. They continue to throw millions (and no doubt soon billions) at ineffective suppression toys, while the few foresters and bush people who know how to manage our public lands are starved of the resources they need to reduce fuel loads.

It is hard for me to see this perversion of public policy and to accept that the folk of the bush have lost their battle to live a safe life in a cared-for rural and forest environment, all because of the environmental fantasies of outraged extremists and latte conservationists.

In a letter to my local paper, the Weekly Times, on January 25, I predicted we were facing a very critical situation in which 1000 to 2000 homes could be lost in the Yarra catchment, the Otways and/or the Strezleckies; that 100 souls could be lost in a most horrible and violent way; and that there was even a threat to Melbourne’s water supply, which could be rendered unusable by the ash and debris. Horrifically, much of this has come to pass, and it is not yet the end of the bushfire season.

In the face of this inferno, the perpetrators of this obscenity should have the decency to stand up and say they were wrong. Southeast Australia is the worst place in the world for bushfires, and we must not waste any time in getting down to the task of making our bush healthy and safe.

But don’t hold your breath. Do you hear that lovely sound the warbling pigs make as they fly by?

David Packham OAM is an honorary senior research fellow at Monash University’s school of geography and environmental science.

 

link

 

In the face of this inferno, the perpetrators of this obscenity should have the decency to stand up and say they were wrong. Southeast Australia is the worst place in the world for bushfires, and we must not waste any time in getting down to the task of making our bush healthy and safe.

A very passionate piece, but I’d love to hear the other side of the argument. My understanding — although brief — is that if burned the right way, it can be ecologically beneficial, but if burned the wrong way at the wrong time for our convenience, it can be absolutely devastating and create a 1 tree species monoculture.

This guy might be a fire expert, but is he an ecologist able to comprehend and visualise the flow on ramifications of our actions through multiple food webs, nutrient balances, species impacts and ecological fallout?

Yes, some people are “uninformed greenies” that just want to “save the forests” even if it means destroying them through neglect of management. But don’t believe the post-fires hype from a “fire expert” that bush management is necessarily “safe” AND “green”. It may not be.

I think at this stage I’m all for compensating victims by relocating the completely burnt out communities. When I hear Kevin Rudd saying “We will rebuild here!” with such gusto, I’m staggered. I wish someone would ask him… “Really? So it can happen again, and we can hear more stories about innocent kids being burnt to death?”

If anyone one comes across a study comparing the fire danger of rural farmlands V “deep bush lands” I’d love to see it. I’m trying to imagine a public policy definition of a “safe enough” area to build in the warmer years ahead.

 

Friend on mine lives in Briagalong ....built into the side of the hill with beautiful outlook but two level pillbox style house ....all open but has huge steel doors /shutter and the tall timber is all about him .......is an apiarist and his plant is unprotected but what can you do.
His biggest issue has been getting occupancy on such a strange building ......but is what is needed and has to be catered for. etc etc etc etc
I live in a wooden house myself that is 110 year dry and surrounded by grain growers with forest at my back fence with two creeks joining causing a nice little knot of tinder dry bushland.
Didn’t need grass to burn on saturday here….the air would have ignited with a match there was so much debri in it during the afternoon squalls on the change. dropped from 46/48 here to about 38 in an hour ....virga was all we got.
Horrid horrid conditions and no one here was going to fight any fires in those conditions…...chase them yes but not fight them.

I’m proud of our state govt spending on fire services that I can see ......Vics the only one I think with a fire map (won’t tag it as it has an overload warning on it at the moment) .....this map has up to the minute warnings….street by street in some cases .....and was invaluable to me when my daughters house was at risk on saturday.
they spend heaps and dumped our petrol fire tankers on NSW and we got new ones all diesels ;) .....we just got another round (I said another round) of new tankers with twin cabs and water curtains and snorkels ....all life saving new gear for the member on the truck .....I have pics I took of our new outfits I was so proud of them and sent them to friends in california .......we have some of the best.
And in bendigo we make thosebushmaster that you see on the fireground ....outfitted with go through the fire gear sprays pumps etc.
Also use of light aircraft and RC aircraft with infrared has been widely tested and used to spot hot spots….all Vic initiatives.
Don’t tell me vic sits on it’s hands…others states and countrys could take lessons.

the green argument on land use is crap in my view .....landcare/farmers and DSE work pretty good together up this way.

Not a place for a political argument ......may be valid but not now please.

I’ll edit, if you will! ;)


and Dave They’re not suggesting abandoning Bendigo! Wow, thanks for the Bendigo stories… I lived there for 3 years at Fortuna Villa doing the Army Survey thing.)
Nah! just gave ‘em a scare.  Over the hill to the nth of the east/west street that Fortuna is on was where the fire got to .....it had a wide and spotty front by then.  Came from the back of the tip in Eaglehawk in the nth and shot down through all the streets and gullys just jumping here and there and leaving panic as it went. Came along one street east of Upper Rd and ran through Cal Gully south toward the calder ....spread along burning the back off the schwepes centre (basketball area you may remember on the Calder/Specie Hill Rd)  and right along up to iron bark corner east along the calder ...not burning all the houses but some here and there (my daughters opposite)
Over the hill from this to the sth is Fortuna…...burnt out some houses here and there along the top of the ridge behind my daughters home (this is behind where the fire actually approached from the front) and would be half way to Fortunas grounds down the other side.
Got close into town as you can see ....took everyone by surprise as this is deep in the burbs.

[ Edited: 10 February 2009 08:47 AM by michael scull]
 

Hi Michael,
I agree… it’s not a knee-jerk reaction to defend the “Greens” as a party or getting political, just mentioning the science from ecologists… which may be vastly different to anything the Greens have proposed, and I understand in many cases does concur with landcare/farmers etc. (But in some ecosystems doesn’t).

This SMH article was interesting. This is already the new norm.

http://www.smh.com.au/environment/scientists-warned-us-this-was-going-to-happen-20090209-82bx.html

People are comparing last Saturday to Ash Wednesday and Black Friday. But this misses the point. We should be comparing these fires to the vast and devastating fires of 2002-03, which swept through 2 million hectares of forest in the south-east and raged uncontrollably for weeks. They have been quickly forgotten because, being mainly in parks, they did not involve a large loss of human life or property. But it is to this fire regime, the new fire regime of climate change, rather than to the regimes of 1983 or 1939, that the present fires belong.

 

edit….Ooops! :rolleyes:

I will chuck in though.  That ‘debri’ in the air out here on saturday would quite honestly ignite in the air.  Dry storm you couldn’t see through .....we all saw it on the news.
Well I think if I gathered a sample i would have found little ‘forest’ in it ....farmland stubble and dry material from years of failed crops….land is without life to break down this material if you look closely.
All blown somewhere else and while it did so I’d say the particulants in it heated it further as it flew through the air to soak the whole state in a soup of hot flammable air.

maybe it’s farmland management that raisied the temps to what they were on saturday…..bet there is an argument for that too.

[ Edited: 10 February 2009 09:07 AM by michael scull]
 

I read somewhere that it comes down to the volume and tonnage of biomass / hectare, but who knows in today’s shifting climate? My brother in law was in Melbourne on Saturday and said they just lay on the floor the whole day to try to keep cool. 46.4 degrees! After days of above 40 degree weather. Insane.

SMH just had a piece saying death toll might hit 300.

 

Well it looks like Danny Nalliah has managed to topple Wilson Tuckey as insensitive idiot of the moment, and by some distance. I’ve created a [url=http://mightychurch.com/forums/viewthread/62/]Danny Nalliah appreciation thread[/url[ here. Good grief.

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We were right on death threat emails

[null]We were right on death threat emailsThe Australian[{}]THE ABC delayed reporting on 11 potentially embarrassing emails until after it ...

takingnote.blogs.nytimes.com »

Does It Mean Anything that a Record Low Are ‘Pro-Choice’?

[null]Does It Mean Anything that a Record Low Are 'Pro-Choice'?New York Times (blog)[{}]Asked to pick one of the two labels applied to the abortion debate, a full 50 percent said they were pro-life, whereas only 41 percent said they were pro-choice, down from the previous low of 42 percent recorded in May of 2009. Republicans are the most ...

and more »

smh.com.au »

Why office chatter is bad for the bottom line

[null]Why office chatter is bad for the bottom lineSydney Morning Herald[{}]The walls have come tumbling down in offices everywhere, but the ...

news.smh.com.au »

Egypt votes in 1st free presidential polls

[null]Egypt votes in 1st free presidential pollsSydney Morning Herald[{}]AP More than 15 months after autocratic leader Hosni Mubarak's ...

smh.com.au »

The trouble with cannabis

[null]The trouble with cannabisSydney Morning Herald[{}]Dope use is increasing, as is the surrounding debate, writes Amy Corderoy. Depending on ...

theaustralian.com.au »

Trevor O’Hoy takes charge of Redcape

[null]Trevor O'Hoy takes charge of RedcapeThe Australian[{}]NEWLY appointed Redcape chairman Trevor O'Hoy says he will spend his first few ...

theaustralian.com.au »

Big Ben running out of time with Reds

[null]Big Ben running out of time with RedsThe Australian[{}]REBELS boss Steve Boland has categorically ruled out any prospect of Reds Test centre ...

theaustralian.com.au »

$1bn fund lures private equity

[null]$1bn fund lures private equityThe Australian[{}]SINGAPORE-BASED private equity group Crest Capital Asia will pour $100 million into what ...

theaustralian.com.au »

Perron trumps Gina if Rio Pilbara deal gets tick of approval

[null]Perron trumps Gina if Rio Pilbara deal gets tick of approvalThe Australian[{}]WHEN Rio Tinto's board sits down in the next few months to ...

smh.com.au »

News trio called on hacking ‘lies’

[null]News trio called on hacking 'lies'Sydney Morning Herald[{}]THREE former executives of Rupert Murdoch's British publishing arm, ...

theaustralian.com.au »

Australian shares tumble on China slowdown fears

[null]Australian shares tumble on China slowdown fearsThe Australian[{}]AUSTRALIA'S sharemarket fell 1.25 per cent amid forecasts for easing ...

theaustralian.com.au »

Web to aid health service delivery

[null]Web to aid health service deliveryThe Australian[{}]THE internet could soon start to accelerate inter-governmental collaboration on delivery ...

theaustralian.com.au »

Arrest threat to PNG judges

[null]Arrest threat to PNG judgesThe Australian[{}]THE effective government of Papua New Guinea says it will arrest the three judges who ordered ...

theaustralian.com.au »

Port Botany docks impede productivity

[null]Port Botany docks impede productivityThe Australian[{}]LOGISTICS problems at the Port Botany docks facility are the single biggest ...